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By danielkorzekwa
via dzone.com
Published: Sep 23 2011 / 03:09

I used to be a big fan of dzone.com both as a reader and active contributor posting a number of articles, but unfortunately over last few months something was pushing me away from dzone.com. Popular dzone links over last 30 days (by votes): Place 1: 10 Excellent Developers Websites You should Bookmark Place 4: Top 10 Remote Desktop Software Place 7: 42 Outstanding FREE UI Kits for Web Designers Place 9: Awesome Chrome Web Apps Worth Checking Out Place 11: Top 15 Fresh And High-Quality Fonts For Designers Position 13: Top 20 Best Android Games 2011 For Free Download and so on... Dear dzone team. Please do something to restore your site as a source of good quality information rather than being just a marketing spam. If I'm the only one dissatisfied with those 'top 10...' posts then I apologize for my ignorance but I'm hoping I'm not.
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User 390780 avatar

spangleweed replied ago:

4 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

It could also do with a different mobile version -- it's a real pain to navigate on a phone.

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Ahahah! That page does not exists anymore. Censure?

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

6 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Censure, are you kidding? We have allowed every stupid whipping-post complaint article ever posted. It's not like we have an obligation to, but we always have allowed them anyway.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

-2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

thanks but that alone cant keep you alive

U must know why else we are here or why we wont be

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

You are misinterpreting what I said.
I didn't screamed that this article was censored, but wondered the possibility of it.

The difference is in the "?".

User 247928 avatar

bustanil replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Page not found?

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Well, when I click on the title, I'm redirected to a "Page not found" ... page. Am I the only one?

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

9 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

But well, regarding the description, I totally agree with you @danielkorzekwa, I also though about writing an article about that. Who cares to have a list of 100+ GREAT JQUERY PLUGINS. A good writer would do the work for the reader and reduce that list to a max of 2/3 plugins per categories.

For more, we have google.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

100% true

User 298727 avatar

ludni replied ago:

2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Totally agree.
But these posts are ranked high because enough people vote them up.
Maybe the readers change ?

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

BINGO! If community members don't vote on articles in the "New links" queue, then they are basically at the mercy of the users who do. We are not in control of the "10 More Silly Ways To Yada-Yada-Yada" articles - those are voted up by USERS!

User 181510 avatar

naviers replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Using votes to determine top links is a very poor way. Tons of users are here just to vote up their propaganda to be in the top links which drives the "real" users away from dzone. Very sad. I'm searching for a another site for more useful stuff.

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

404 as well - I don't like this censorship.

We're capable enough to make up our own opinions on an article.
,

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

What censorship? Don't be silly.

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I've already replied, thanked and apologised to Matt's update. No need to come wading in, heavy handed, after the fact.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Kynth, someone else may not see that in the 25th comment, instead they only see that you leapt to a conclusion that was incorrect. I didn't delete your comment, but don't suggest that I shouldn't reply to it so others realize you were incorrect. You made a groundless accusation that has clearly snowballed, and you should consider that such accusations harm others who are innocent of what you accuse. An apology after the fact doesn't really help.

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

And that same person may now only see you denigrate my comment before reaching my own apology later on. I do not appreciate that, it makes me feel like I'm being portrayed unfairly as a silly person who is happy to reach an incorrect conclusion and proceed to attempt to drag down a service by squealing (v.i.)?

Do you appreciate how offensive this comes across? I'm (normally) an easy going guy though, so I'm assuming you don't intend it to come across this way under the auspices of damage control. If you're happy that reaching an incorrect conclusion is also forgiveable then maybe we can call it quits?

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Kynth, you make a fair point. Let's move on.

User 390896 avatar

venceremos replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

+1 Censorship sucks.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

3 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

We agree, that's why we wouldn't have done it. It's a totally unfounded accusation.

User 390896 avatar

venceremos replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Sorry for that. I do realize my mistake now. Nevertheless the point is a valid one. It is really difficult to find something usefull on dzone lately. Some changes are probably necessary. Maybe You guys should provide some kind of widget which put on the blog page would allow dzone to count the traffic of a blog page. Traffic stats could give a better view on a post value that up/down votes. Just something You might think about. I do know there is a long way from conpect to product.

Dzone is still a valuable source of traffic so I think that it is not unrealistic that bloggers would go through the hassle to put the dzone widget on their page.

User 906523 avatar

nofater replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Yep, this "Top 10 libs everybody already knows about" lists are very annoyng. I would prefer to see some in-depth analysis or an exhaustive use case comparison which makes this libraries distinguishable.

Censorship of constructive criticism is a bad habit..

User 450812 avatar

TitanKing replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I cant vote for it any more :( I do agree that the top lists should be more actual information, like:
"How to create a LDAP login for Framework Whatever" or more development related news. Too many bloggers found out by posting a post with TOP 10 whatever and doing no real research behind it brings in hits. Bad blogger!

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

i guess We need a Top Zone to put such crap, those top 100 this crap and top 1000 that thrash is taking down Dzone.

100 JQuery plugins, R U KIDIDING ?

that too in the era of GWT and JAvaFX.

User 867757 avatar

cfoley.myopenid.com replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Oops. I upvoted by mistake. The article is down so I've not even been able to read it.

User 880871 avatar

SomMeri replied ago:

5 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I agree. I used to go here to:
a.) learn,
b.) inspire myself,
c.) find new solutions to old problems
d.) find about new stuff.

Most recent topics are:
a.) top N best whatever,
b.) scala is great,
c.) agile is great.

Note: I have no problem with "how to do X in scala" or scala tutorials. I'm annoyed by those pure propaganda articles.

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Hey DZONE, do you hear us?

User 934223 avatar

newcron replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Indeed, quality of articles on DZone is significantly dropping. What I also dislike a lot is, are the "Hello World in Java Turorial" posts, that are somewhat spammy.
I am really missing higher qualified stuff about some serious technologies here.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Yes, you are missing most of the best stuff because you probably only visit the "New links" queue and vote on upcoming articles once in a blue moon. It's really simple, if an article doesn't receive votes while it is in the "New links" stage, then it can NEVER reach the front page. If people want to make the more technical articles popular, they need to visit the "New links" queue often and vote for what they like.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

how about one button to vote for them all ie,. categories like Rookie, or EXPERT or EXCELLENT, POOR , cutting edge, in beta mode, "non development crap", and lastly an CUSTOM option as a last one in the drop down, steal some features from Google plus ;-)

Thus we can heavily filter out all that each of us think is super dumb crap

edit : only 5 minutes to edit and that too with no delete option for double posts due to slow internet

User 277931 avatar

Jason Whaley replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

or perhaps the UX of Dzone isn't making it easy nor obvious enough to do this? Sites like this are basically a crowd sourced recommendation engine for links... and all recommendation engines have to solve the same UX problems - one of which is filtering items to users where said items (at least in this case) have very little to no information about them. Without providing some way to encourage users to read beyond the front page you won't get it either and your site continues to be run by a mob (ala Digg).

As for a concrete suggestion - how about including a tab on the left replacing "Rising Links" with "Latest Links" or prompt the user? Or if you don't perceive this is a problem then that's OK too.

User 42872 avatar

cafebabe replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Censorship?
Then access to coffee will denied for you.

Bye.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Once again, the folks who suggested censorship were simply dead wrong. There was no censorship, and there was not even any reasonable foundation for their accusations. It was just another case of someone leaping to a conclusion and doing damage to someone else's reputation.

User 317034 avatar

vassyz replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Big mistake Dzone. I'm outta here.

User 200690 avatar

a1programmer replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Mirror anyone ?

User 855949 avatar

Sandeep Bhandari replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Now the usual voters like mswatcher, mitcp and other people directly associated with Dzone are not voting for this post. Anybody listening?

User 767325 avatar

neilstock replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

stop it being a dumping ground for JCG links also

User 301880 avatar

hjuskewycz replied ago:

2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

omg, censorship. pathetic

I voted up just for the censorship, I hope we will see a mirror

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Honestly, do you believe every unfounded accusation you hear from someone you probably don't even know (and have no reason to trust.) The users above who squealed about censorship had no basis whatsoever for making such allegations. They were dead wrong - no such thing happened, period.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

THERE IS O CENSORSHIP GUYS SO STOP REPEATING THE NONSENSE

User 2 avatar

matt replied ago:

13 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Hi folks. I just want to clarify that we didn't censor anything. The original poster linked to a page that didn't exist or wasn't actually published (and this post was published in the middle of the night). :). His post was actually self contained in the description of this link.

That said, we agree! We are actually making active changes to the way that DZone works and you should be seeing a new blog launching that actually highlights the coming changes and what we are doing to improve the process and the content.

As for the articles - it is a function of who is voting and who is posting. Be sure to vote for the articles you really want to see! You can also expect a lot more personalization in the near future so you never have to see those kinds of links anyway. We take the feedback seriously. If you have concerns, feel free to email me personally at matt@dzone.com and chat about it!

Thanks!
Matt

User 301880 avatar

hjuskewycz replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

thanks for clarification matt.

User 200690 avatar

a1programmer replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Matt, thanks for the follow up.

User 42872 avatar

cafebabe replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Good to hear that.

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Thanks for the *useful* clarification.

Hope to see changes in the near future :)

User 265881 avatar

Topnotch replied ago:

5 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Honestly, those spam links are being promoted by vote-stuffers. Who are vote-stuffers? They are usually people who create fake accounts for the purpose of promoting their lackluster content. Best way to spot them? Just look at the data: you'll routinely see a new account with upvotes against a single domain mostly in order to fraudulently get it to the top page. I've seen this behavior with script-tutorials.com, dotnetaid.com ,i-programmer.info(mike james or someone related to his website uses the goldi3535 account to get links to the front page at times. ), and others. Honestly , vote-stuffing has been a problem for a while and I believe it to be at the root of what you are upset about but there aren't any easy solutions to catch and stop vote-stuffing being used to get not so interesting content to the top 10.
,

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

how about a "probably spam" button ?

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Thanks for the response Matt, it's reassuring.

Apologies for misinterpreting the problem as censorship.

User 209684 avatar

jonjonz replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

It is happening to all the social sites, top contributors eventually realize they are getting nothing in return for making the site owners rich and move on. They get replaced by marketing spam. You can gauge the health of any social site by the ration of spam to real posts. In the long run, every social media site goes this route. I say good riddance. This current hipster generation is going to be royally screwed a few years down the road when their job app or mortage app or car load application is turned down due to some factoid mined from the social db kept on them. Lets see you visited xyz site, which just happens to advertise Aids cures (bogus), this eventual turns into a mined information that implies you are likely to have aids, so no health care coverage for you.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

You are undoubtedly correct about people's fear that anything and everything they say or do on the internet will someday be held against them by a corporate HR representative searching Google. I think you've got it all wrong about top contributors, however.

User 338269 avatar

Miloskov replied ago:

2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Matt responded, I think here the problem are the readers that they vote for that crap of articles, me when I see not related articles or the marketing ones I just vote down for them and you people should do the same, if everybody do this those spammers will go away cause it will get difficult for them to get more votes and get to the front page. Also Dzone should apply more things to accounts like check IPs and relate that IP with the user account. If you see steam accounts control they are trying to do a good thing for secure more the accounts. If the user changes IP so it have to verify again with his email account so it can post and vote again in dzone, there are many ways to try to stop this spammers and marketers doing bad or hurting dzone.

Anyway Thanks to Dzone and Matt to listen to their users, cheers.

User 338269 avatar

Miloskov replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

By the way, DZone needs a mobile version, I cant watch good the content on an cell phone.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Of course we are ALWAYS listening, and it is good to know that those who are chiming in seem to care. I'm not going to be political here, though. When I read complaints about the links that are made popular there is only ONE group who should be called out for that - you guys, the people who all somehow see fit to vote for this complaint!

Social link-sharing operates on a very simple concept: it uplifts the items that get the most popular support. I'm willing to bet that if we did a simple analysis of the other votes placed by the 64 voters (at this moment) who have up voted this article, then we'd discover that most of them vote less than once a month on ANYTHING! In fact, I would actually put money on a bet that over 50% of them have NEVER EVER voted on ANYTHING from the "New links" queue, which is the only place that has any influence over what makes it to the front page.

ANyone who has spent any time at the DZone office during the past year or more has undoubtedly heard me say that I believe the social link sharing model is like a dead man walking. The truth is that almost ALL of the audience expects to enjoy the benefits while everyone else does the work. It is a byproduct of a sea-change on the web in which the vast majority now view themselves simply as consumers of content, and @jonjonz above is correct that most of you live in fear that anything you say or do on the internet will be held against you in some future job interview. All in all, it is a sad situation, certainly DZone is not to blame.

An amazing number of awesome links pass through the "New links" queue and never make it to the front page. In most cases, there's precisely one person to blame for this: yourself. We will change the model at DZone because the writing is on the wall, and the overwhelming majority of you aren't willing to click a simple vote button even if it make the difference between having a great site or enduring yet another crappy "Top 10 Ways To Blah Blah Blah."

Rick Ross
Founder, DZone

PS - I think I will go ahead and produce an analysis to test my theory about whether the "me, too" folks who voted for this article have actually participated in the normal activity that must power every social link sharing site. This should be interesting.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

i have already posted suggestion in previous post but to make a point here, the thing i feel they WONT vote because

a) they have no idea about that thing

b) thats not what they want to put time in

And that means to get the right votes right articles should be show to right people ONLY

categories categories categories, let the voters choose categories while voting instead of the post creators, so that next voter will help further refine it

User 855949 avatar

Sandeep Bhandari replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I will give a simple example for pathetic articles getting promoted.
JCG is run by 5 folks and all of them have profile on DZone. So any link from JCG gets 5 votes without any problem and is bound to be promoted.
It doesn't stop here only, they won't vote for other links and hence pure marketing and nothing else.
DZone should also place a check for any pattern in the voting.

User 888091 avatar

me.yahoo.com/a/R6xBmQhuioE5J2C.gUdxsp224uch0rURqQ-- replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Why? They have every write to write blogs about their products and their team of supporting that product, I have seen no sales pitches or anything of the sort that is qualified as spam.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

5 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

As a simple point of reference, @danielkorzekwa (the original poster), you have been a member for nearly two years and have posted 13 links (almost all of them to your own blog, with their corresponding votes for yourself.) In that time you have only voted only 5 times EVER for anything else. Less than one vote per three months, yet you expect the system to produce results that match your tastes and preferences. I must ask you, is this a reasonable expectation?

User 692777 avatar

danielkorzekwa replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Dear Rick,
I haven't voted anything down so far, because I had no reason for that. Please notice that for me, being disappointed by some posts such as 'top 10 bla bla bla...’ isn't necessarily a good enough reason for voting something down, especially if I haven't read the whole article. I have similar reasoning about my 5 up votes I gave so far. But my general and growing dissatisfaction over last few months with a content provided and presented to me by dzone.com is a good reason for sharing my opinion with a community. Maybe I just don’t get the point of those up/down buttons? If so I apologize for that.

Additionally, please don't get me wrong, I'd love to read dzone.com every day, but for that to happen, you the dzone.com team, really have to improve the quality of your site. Please don't say that your site is as good as a community proactive is, because it's not the whole truth. Having access to nearly unlimited web resources and artificial intelligence techniques, you might try to make dzone.com more intelligent than just relying on a simple vote up/down system, for example providing individually suited content would be great. I know it’s not simple, but if you want to be the number one IT news site in the world you can’t just make simple things.

In the end I feel sorry by some confusion around censure. It was also my mistake as I could predict people’s reaction to publishing broken link with a such content. However, I hope that in overall there are more positives than negatives for both dzone.com team and the community coming from my post.

I’m looking forward hearing about some great changes in dzone.com.

Regards.
Daniel

User 450767 avatar

AnkurSharma replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Interestingly despite all the talk, nobody voted down this link. At least, till I wrote this and there were 69 in favor.

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

AnkurSharma - good point - I have cast my lonely down vote. Thanks!

User 450767 avatar

AnkurSharma replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Since there really was no link, I am with you.

User 170399 avatar

jbuchberger replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

if you are (like me) just interested into certain category of posts or links ...
- use the tag cloud
- use one of the Zones
- use the search box
- upvote posts you like

however, there is room for improvement like ...
- improved detection of spamvotes
- more advanced filtering query options for top links, popular links and new links (dzone users might be much more diverse now than in the past, so such filters would help a great deal to adjust to ones own focus)

@Rick @Matt - do you hear me? ;-)

User 1 avatar

rick replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

@jbuchberger, we are definitely listening. This is good material for a really positive discussion, but this particular link thread is not the place to have it.

Rick

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Can I add a suggestion to look at how the system handles posts that can't be found, either when posted or later deleted?

If there hadn't been an unfortunate 404 on this particular post, then a few reasonable people (including myself) may not have drawn an incorrect conclusion.

(Edit: This was meant to have been in reply to jbuchberger's suggestion comment, I'm guessing I clicked the wrong "reply" button)

User 888091 avatar

me.yahoo.com/a/R6xBmQhuioE5J2C.gUdxsp224uch0rURqQ-- replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Top x is always popular way to catch attention, this is a democratic voting system, one click one vote, so can't blame dzone for this. just don't vote and they wont become popular, or vote up other articles, or start doing top 10 posts.
,

User 191095 avatar

jonj replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I love dzone. It's one of the few places I come to for new information. It's not perfect though. I don't think users can be completely to blame for the quality of links. What is it, 80% of most users are consumers of the internet while 20% actually contribute and post content ? It's the same deal here. I read these articles all the time, but I don't believe I've ever upvoted or downvoted an article. In fact, I might have only clicked the "new links" section once or twice over the period of a couple of years. It's not because I'm unwilling to do this, on stackoverflow I do it quite often. Maybe the difference is I feel no incentive to vote here. I'm not sure.

But while i have dzone staff's attention, one thing that's been irking me is the search. I come here to learn and to keep myself updated, but searching for anything will return old articles from several years ago. If there's a way to search by "most recent" date, please let me know.

Finally, the one thing I miss is the old javalobby. I don't know why, but the change from javalobby to a dzone "zone" kind of killed off that community. Previously, it was very common to see discussions reaching 30+ replies and I used to love reading them. These days articles posted there are lucky to get a few replies.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

thats because refreshing whole page to reply or vote down coment is painful waste of time

User 236075 avatar

henk replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

> 80% of most users are consumers of the internet while 20% actually contribute and post content

I think the numbers are much worse. It's not rarely that you see articles having say 6000 views and there's maybe 1 or 2 comments. I think 999‰ consumers, 1‰ contributors is a better approximation.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

whoah,
and was wondering how come everyone else is not pissed

User 191095 avatar

jonj replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Update to my previous post: Search now appears to be searching by "most recent" by default now! :) So ignore that part of my post, haha. Perhaps consider showing "new links" by default instead of the most popular? Adding reputation points? I'm not sure.

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

lastly i would like to suggest to use GWT for developing next version so that we will never see a page refresh ever for anything

:p

User 193069 avatar

twheeler replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I'll add that it's really annoying (and a potential invasion of privacy IMHO) that links in articles out of the DZone site don't break out of the frame at the top of the page. To see what I mean, go here:

http://java.dzone.com/articles/logging-mess

and then click the link in the first paragraph of the story, which points to someone's personal blog. There is absolutely no reason for that top frame to remain once I leave your site -- I know how to use the back button if I need it. I also know how to break out of your frames on my own, but my point is that I shouldn't have to.

Sure, java.net and about.com do this too, but if your goal is to attract and retain users, those are *not* sites you'd be wise to emulate.

User 905489 avatar

jogee replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Another case of 'victim of it's own success'

User 905489 avatar

jogee replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Another case of 'victim of it's own success'
And another case of double posting with no possibility to delete.

User 209461 avatar

irbull replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

A few years ago (On April 1st) I wrote a (tongue in cheek) article about how to get a post on DZone... The number one way, formulate your post as a top 10 list.

http://blog.ianbull.com/2008/04/10-ways-to-get-article-on-dzone.html

One of the comments mentioned: "I think it's mostly because this indicates a structured article which is quicker to read. It works, from my experience." Not saying I agree, just say'n.

User 338269 avatar

Miloskov replied ago:

2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Ok I fixed my vote to down, Thanks Rick to step into this discussion, Thanks for clarify.

I use just 2 sites of the internet DZone and Google that's the internet for me, So I hope everything goes great for DZone.

User 252604 avatar

clavalle replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Perhaps a 'flag as marketing' button? That way users can do just a smidge more than vote up and down. More work and somebody would have to eyeball and moderate it but it would help eliminate the possibility that smarmy marketers are abusing the vote up/down mechanic.

User 209461 avatar

irbull replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

The challenge is that what someone views as 'marketing' others view as 'interesting technical content'. We posted some stuff about a product we had that offered a free offering and a paid subscription. Some people got upset and said we were 'simply advertising'. On the other hand, IntelliJ often has lot of posts on DZone and they offer the same sort of model.

Is Windows 8 New and Noteworthy considered Marketing? What about Fedora 16?

User 252604 avatar

clavalle replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Of course it is a matter of degree which is why it would take some human judgement to determine.
The most egregious are the raw product announcements. Those pages that are a half a paragraph blurb and possibly a few bullet points put out directly by the company. On the other end is someone posing an interesting technical problem or analysis with lots of code and no direct bias. Then everything else is somewhere in the middle.

At the very least, such a mechanic would force people who are interested in marketing to the DZone crowd to put more thought and time into the product announcement to explain in detail why some feature or another is cool or to have an example along with the bullet points or what have you. True 'interesting technical content' beyond a 'trust us this is cool come sign up' kind of a teaser.

Oftentimes the company is the absolute best source for analysis and news. I am not against companies promoting their products with truly interesting articles, but I don't want DZone to end up like TheServerSide where it is so much marketing content to wade through that it is not worth the trouble.

User 415569 avatar

Daniel Ribeiro replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Well, you could always start reading Hacker News/following the Hacker News aggegator profiles:

http://news.ycombinator.com/

http://twitter.com/#!/newsyc20

http://twitter.com/#!/newsyc50

http://twitter.com/#!/newsyc100

http://twitter.com/#!/newsyc150

User 880871 avatar

SomMeri replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I through that it is mostly about views/clicks ratio. I read that on the meta.dzone a while ago. It never occurred to me to down vote uninteresting links. I through I'm supposed to just ignore them. Up and down votes are for stuff you have read.

Maybe it is only because I'm sitting behind mini PC, but my firefox is much slower if I have tab with dzone frame open. So I'm closing frames as soon as I can. When I have the frame available, I click votes more often.

The same apply for main and new links pages.

User 236075 avatar

henk replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

>We, the people who want to see great links, need to do more!

I agree with this!

Too many people are so often complaining about everything, but rarely actually doing something to make it better. It's not really different from those guys who moan how many bugs Java has, or how many bugs Eclipse has, etc. When did you last contribute a patch?

And for those people who still complain how bad and complex Java EE is. When did you last posted your ideas when the EG asked for it?

And it's the same for Dzone. If you don't like the posts appearing on the index, downvote them and upvote the good ones in the New Links queue. Comment on those articles which you think are bad and explain why they are bad.

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

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A potential idea behind the upvote/downvote work could be inspired by how stackoverflow.com works.

The basic idea (give points when you have an upvote, loose points with a downvote for both the voter and the author) wouldn't work (it's quite similar to "just" up/down vote), but with a specific algorithm, it could be potentially great. For example, attributing more or less points to an up/down vote regarding how many people already voted them, who voted it (if someone with 23k+ points vote up an article, it means more than someone with 1 point).

That's a potential idea that would require a more profound reflexion to work. of course.

User 236075 avatar

henk replied ago:

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>(if someone with 23k+ points vote up an article, it means more than someone with 1 point).

You would say so, but that too might have problems. I noticed e.g. recently that there's something of an anti-Java atmosphere on reddit's programming section. Over time, it seems a somewhat Java hostile Python crowd has gathered there who is 'feverishly' down voting Java articles. Not a lot of Java articles on the main page, means not a lot of Java users visit it, which means not a lot of votes for Java articles, which means evens less Java articles etc. It spirals downwards.

But presumably the users doing the down voting have a high reputation there, as they frequently post articles that get many votes, comment a lot, and are generally serious users. It might not even be a conscious conspiracy, but something that might just have grown.

So if you're going to throw reputation in the mix, you might want to do something extra there. Although I don't think it influences voting, StackOverflow does have the concept of ranking per tag. Since DZone already has tagging, this could perhaps be taken into account.

User 880871 avatar

SomMeri replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I have some more things:
1.) My views and clicks on link I posted should not count. I like to check how the link is doing. That should not influence its ranking.

2.) I assume that most people only read content, they do not post. Unless you want to post, there is no reason to register. If you do not register, you can not vote. Only minority of readers has a right to vote.

I'm not sure what is the solution here. Maybe if people could log in with their open id/facebook/twitter accounts? It would be an alternative to registering. (I prefer registering :) )

User 802779 avatar

kainwood replied ago:

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I agree with what you said.

We are all thinking of a way to allow only "trusted" people to vote for articles. And tries to avoid the "tell all my friend to upvote my post to be in the popular links" effect.

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Stackoverflow inspired points system, you need a minimum to vote, you earn by posting or other performing other sensible activities on the site.

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Stackoverflow inspired points system, you need a minimum to vote, you earn by posting or other performing other sensible activities on the site.

User 449039 avatar

Kynth replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Stackoverflow inspired points system, you need a minimum to vote, you earn by posting or other performing other sensible activities on the site.

User 160034 avatar

javageek replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

I stopped caring about DZone after someone asked me to vote for some random chick (lizzy?) on some random contest using the official DZone channel. I found it in real bad taste to abuse a very legitimate developer site with personal and completely unrelated requests.

Also, I've moved most of my browsing habits to a more mobile approach (iPad). Unfortunately some sites like DZone are just not prepared for the mobile platforms.

DZone is keeping a social network model that stopped working for most sites because of how easy it is to game the system.

User 902267 avatar

javakata replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Yeah and you know what, now this garbage of an article is amongs the top links. God, I'm so sick of "bla" like articles for the sake of attention such as "how I got pissed of yesterday because of x" and "technology t1 is so much better than t2 because I have one single marginal example of that". Now this already is meta-bla, you're not even ranting about something, you're ranting about ranting. Here's the deal captain: no-one's forcing you to read stuff on dzone. Show me the person that holds a gun to your tiny head forcing you to read it, and I'll talk that person out of it, ok? Fucking hell, how much attention do you crave, you're ripping on a free resource that you can use as you wish.
,

User 855949 avatar

Sandeep Bhandari replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Five features I would like to see:

1) Add keyboard shortcuts
a) Scrolling in links using arrow keys as with Google search results
b) Shortcut to add a new link
c) Delete a link from view using delete key so that the current user won't see the link in future but others can
2) Add more tags for the posts to be posted in
3) Advanced search filters
4) Pre-defined and public critera for a post to become promoted. (of course this has to be roboust as it can be misused)
5) Avoid people from posting without giving votes to other posts

User 913261 avatar

sanrodari replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Im a great dzone fan. I think this post will help to improve lot of things. Im agree with the basic post idea. I hope all those things help to improve quality content and we have a better page.

User 275157 avatar

jpox1 replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

as others have purported, your voting system is broken. Take right now for instance, we have some spamming marketing link from Chronon system with more downvotes than upvotes, but its in the "top articles" (i.e front page of JavaLobby). Fix that before anything else

User 855949 avatar

Sandeep Bhandari replied ago:

-2 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Also stop showing that iFrame when someone clicks on a link. That hinders my browsing. For example: I am usually curious to know the CMS/Blog/Analytics/JavaScript frameworks used by a website so I have to click that cross icon every time which is frustrating at times. Either remove it or find some other way for article to get up/down votes (when clicked). I am not sure how many people want that but I want that for sure.

User 257910 avatar

goshki replied ago:

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@bhandari4u you can disable this option in your profile settings: Display Preferences -> Show DZone frame when links are opened.

User 193069 avatar

twheeler replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Who would intentionally want this frame? I'd suggest making it disabled by default and count how many people turn it back on. I'll bet it's close to zero.

User 929105 avatar

amicrux replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Surprise, a post with wrong category selection still survives till now and getting 150 around up votes, i hope dzone will do something with these kind of links.

User 902267 avatar

javakata replied ago:

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Hey you know what, there's actually a use to this post. I always tried to remember the people who posted good content vs the people that only posted/commented crap. I no longer need that in memory list, I have it right here: +1 voters = douches, -1 voters=worth remembering. Thanks, poster you did me a great favor, guess on which list you're going.

User 902267 avatar

javakata replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

In fact, now that I look on those lists, I cann see that most of the people on both sides were already on those sides in the list I was making by myself before.

User 226998 avatar

polterguy replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

They're fixing it these days ...

http://www.dzone.com/blog/2011/09/just-fkin-kill-it/

Great job Rick & Co ... :)

User 393686 avatar

RawThinkTank replied ago:

1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

Amazingly what failed Digg.com has been used as an asset at Google Plus and Diaspora.

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RawThinkTank replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

"– the KILL button"

Wow cool thanks, i hope the competitors dont kill the hell out of each other with it, and also those filled with prejudice and with hunger for vengeance

;-)

instead read my above posts carefully, i am the think tank here :-p

User 1048255 avatar

yaval replied ago:

-1 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

This OCR software worked great for me and my company! http://www.cvisiontech.com/products/general/maestro-recognition-server.html?lang=eng

User 1027883 avatar

MSArticles replied ago:

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Agreed

User 825909 avatar

Neveg replied ago:

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The difference is in the "?"

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dzafar.sadik replied ago:

0 votes Vote down Vote up Reply

censorship sucks

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